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abelard
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 Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 5:33 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 20:52:07 -0700 (PDT), forbisgaryg@msn.com wrote:
| Quote: |
On Jul 16, 10:15 am, abelard <abela...@abelard.org> wrote:
On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 05:10:25 -0700 (PDT), forbisga...@msn.com wrote:
Times are just different. Sure, in 1958 I was dreaming of owning a
personal
computer
no you weren't
OK, I may be off by a few years.
This paper is from 1959.
http://www.research.ibm.com/journal/rd/033/ibmrd0303B.pdf
I was reading Scientific American by first grade, that would have been
58.
I remember reading the article about it in Scientific American but I
don't
remember many of the details. By fourth grade we had a guy from IBM
come to school and talk about computer. I told him I was going to
own.
Most of my friends thought I was crazy for wanting a computer of my
own.
I was happy to learn how cheap computers had become when I first read
about SDS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_Data_Systems
I was writing FORTRAN by 1966. In the year Instant Insanity came out
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instant_Insanity
I wrote a program to solve it where I put the names of the colors on
cards, comma separated, one card per cube, then looked at the printout
to find the solution. So somewhere closer to 58 than 67 I started
dreaming
of owning a personal computer (even though I thought of them first as
room
sized, then as desk sized.) My first computer was an Altair 8800. I
got it
in 76.
I almost frogot about Forbidden Panet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forbidden_Planet
I guess Altair reminded me. Robby seemed like a good idea.
Personal Robots have been a dream ever since as well. I was
very wrong about how soon that would happen.
I was trying to track down the exact time from my early reading
of "I, Robot". The copy I got wasn't really supposed to be sold.
the top half of the front cover had been ripped off. I learn several
years later that this was all they resubmitted to the publisher to
indicate that they didn't sell the book. The rest was supposed to
be destroyed. It's interesting (to me) that in my early mind I tied
"Robbie" of "I, Robot" to "Robby" of "Forbidden Planet."
After reading all of the "Luck Starr" series I could get at the
library
|
from another of my posts from the deep past:
i wonder when asimov made the connection between 'positronic brains'
and computers.
clearly he had by 1990....('the robot chronicles', in 'gold',
0006482023, pp 213-234)
he states effectively that he had no thought of computers being robots
in 1955 p.227
he states that by 1956 he was getting the idea....though i find him
unconvincing p.228
| Quote: |
I learn that Paul French and Issac Asimov were one and the same.
I can place this before the Kennedy assination so that somewhere
between 58 and 63. I was heavily into SciFi. Dystopias didn't
matter.
I wish I could remember or find when Bell Labs demonstrated their
voice synthesizer on Ed Sullivan, since that might help me pin down
the time.
Why are we quibbling about 5 years in my preteens?
|
i'll ask jeeves...or bertie....
--
web site at www.abelard.org - news comment service, logic, economics
energy, education, politics, etc 1,552,396 document calls in year past
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
all that is necessary for [] walk quietly and carry
the triumph of evil is that [] a big stick.
good people do nothing [] trust actions not words
only when it's funny -- roger rabbit
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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Bert Hyman
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:23 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk (Robert Henderson) wrote in
news:eSIAxrdyZgfIFwAr@anywhere.demon.co.uk:
| Quote: |
People do not miss that which they do not have. Most importantly man
does not live by bread alone
|
Do you think they'd miss the bread if they didn't have it?
--
Bert Hyman | St. Paul, MN | bert@iphouse.com |
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Robert Henderson
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:59 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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In message <n8eu741vqk15k70m10f5lr4sucj011rf1m@4ax.com>, abelard
<abelard3@abelard.org> writes
| Quote: |
On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 05:34:57 +0100, Robert Henderson
philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk> wrote:
In message <35bs741ri1r1e73uhvgk2hph6mngb4rho6@4ax.com>, abelard
abelard3@abelard.org> writes
much less taisty purchased goods.
Times are just different. Sure, in 1958 I was dreaming of owning a
personal computer
no you weren't
The idea of personal computers was in SF by that time.... RH
even asimov wasn't dreaming of owning a pc....
The complete stories, vol. 1, I.Asimov, 1994, harper collins,
0006476473,
from 'the feeling of power' pp297-308, first published in 1957
'for that matter, compare your pocket computer with the massive jobs
of a thousand years ago' p.304.
|
Sigh. The point is they were envisaged. RH
--
Robert Henderson
Blair Scandal website: http://www.geocities.com/ blairscandal/
Personal website: http://www.anywhere.demon.co.uk |
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Robert Henderson
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:00 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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In message <Xns9ADE556936C2BVeebleFetzer@127.0.0.1>, Bert Hyman
<bert@iphouse.com> writes
| Quote: |
philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk (Robert Henderson) wrote in
news:eSIAxrdyZgfIFwAr@anywhere.demon.co.uk:
People do not miss that which they do not have. Most importantly man
does not live by bread alone
Do you think they'd miss the bread if they didn't have it?
|
That is not the point of the adage. RH
--
Robert Henderson
Blair Scandal website: http://www.geocities.com/ blairscandal/
Personal website: http://www.anywhere.demon.co.uk |
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abelard
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 8:12 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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|
On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 07:14:49 -0700 (PDT), forbisgaryg@msn.com wrote:
| Quote: |
On Jul 17, 5:33 am, abelard <abela...@abelard.org> wrote:
On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 20:52:07 -0700 (PDT), forbisga...@msn.com wrote:
On Jul 16, 10:15 am, abelard <abela...@abelard.org> wrote:
On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 05:10:25 -0700 (PDT), forbisga...@msn.com wrote:
Times are just different. Sure, in 1958 I was dreaming of owning a
personal
computer
no you weren't
OK, I may be off by a few years.
This paper is from 1959.
http://www.research.ibm.com/journal/rd/033/ibmrd0303B.pdf
I was reading Scientific American by first grade, that would have been
58.
I remember reading the article about it in Scientific American but I
don't
remember many of the details. By fourth grade we had a guy from IBM
come to school and talk about computer. I told him I was going to
own.
Most of my friends thought I was crazy for wanting a computer of my
own.
I was happy to learn how cheap computers had become when I first read
about SDS
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_Data_Systems
I was writing FORTRAN by 1966. In the year Instant Insanity came out
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instant_Insanity
I wrote a program to solve it where I put the names of the colors on
cards, comma separated, one card per cube, then looked at the printout
to find the solution. So somewhere closer to 58 than 67 I started
dreaming
of owning a personal computer (even though I thought of them first as
room
sized, then as desk sized.) My first computer was an Altair 8800. I
got it
in 76.
I almost frogot about Forbidden Panet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forbidden_Planet
I guess Altair reminded me. Robby seemed like a good idea.
Personal Robots have been a dream ever since as well. I was
very wrong about how soon that would happen.
I was trying to track down the exact time from my early reading
of "I, Robot". The copy I got wasn't really supposed to be sold.
the top half of the front cover had been ripped off. I learn several
years later that this was all they resubmitted to the publisher to
indicate that they didn't sell the book. The rest was supposed to
be destroyed. It's interesting (to me) that in my early mind I tied
"Robbie" of "I, Robot" to "Robby" of "Forbidden Planet."
After reading all of the "Luck Starr" series I could get at the
library
from another of my posts from the deep past:
i wonder when asimov made the connection between 'positronic brains'
and computers.
clearly he had by 1990....('the robot chronicles', in 'gold',
0006482023, pp 213-234)
he states effectively that he had no thought of computers being robots
in 1955 p.227
he states that by 1956 he was getting the idea....though i find him
unconvincing p.228
Just consider http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turing_test
It should be obvious many were making the connection by 58.
I wasn't born until 52. Many of my early memories are fading
but many still exist. Certainly I was thinking about technology
in 56 but it wasn't computers but rather about our new airline
record player as opposed to the windup motorola my neighbor
had. During those two years between 56 and 58 I was watching
TV on my neighbor's set. I thought of her as an aunt and she
enjoyed having us, the neighbor kids, around. We had a TV
before 58 but my parrents lied about it working most of the time
though they say otherwise now. We were poor but one didn't
nottice when that's all one knew and we were rich in other ways
than money and things. Even at three years of age in Parsons
Kansas I was roaming freely and safely blocks from home.
It's hard to nail this stuff down because the first date I remember
is 1957 and the only reason I remember that date is because
my brother showed me the writing on our school pictures and
told me that the writing on it was the school year "1956-1957".
OK, I probably wasn't thinking of owning a computer in 1958.
Again, it's just a quibble of a few years. I learned boolean
algebra in about 1961 when my Dad had to learn it for his
new job at Boeing. I was the sounding board for tasks such
as drawing maps and simplifying by circles around sets of
ones. I was learning xy + x = x about the same time I was
learing xy + x = x(y+1).
My memories are skewed by youth. Everything seemed fresh
at the time and the possibilities were endless. I remember looking
up at the sky and seeing Sputnik move in the heavens. What
did I know of global politics? The important part was seeing a
man made object in the night sky. (pre-cub scouts)
|
this is turing in 1950
http://www.abelard.org/turpap/turpap.htm
"It will simplify matters for the reader if I explain first my own
beliefs in the matter. Consider first the more accurate form of the
question. I believe that in about fifty years time it will be possible
to programme computers with a storage capacity of about 10^9 to make
them play the imitation game so well that an average interrogator will
not have more than 70 per cent chance of making the right
identification after five minutes of questioning. The original
question, 'Can machines think?' I believe to be too meaningless to
deserve discussion. Nevertheless I believe that at the end of the
century the use of words and general educated opinion will have
altered so much that one will be able to speak of machines thinking
without expecting to be contradicted. I believe further that no useful
purpose is served by concealing these beliefs. The popular view that
scientists proceed inexorably from well-established fact to
well-established fact, never being influenced by any unproved
conjecture, is quite mistaken. Provided it is made clear which are
proved facts and which are conjectures, no harm can result.
Conjectures are of great importance since they suggest useful lines of
research."
....
you may be interested in comments here on memory...
http://www.abelard.org/briefings/repressed_memory.htm
--
web site at www.abelard.org - news comment service, logic, economics
energy, education, politics, etc 1,552,396 document calls in year past
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
all that is necessary for [] walk quietly and carry
the triumph of evil is that [] a big stick.
good people do nothing [] trust actions not words
only when it's funny -- roger rabbit
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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William Black
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:18 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
|
|
"JNugent" <JN@NPPTG.com> wrote in message
news:ufOdnX8jCIsTHuPVnZ2dnUVZ8vqdnZ2d@pipex.net...
| Quote: |
William Black wrote:
and today food is
much cheaper coming from a supermarket than your local butcher or veg
shop
so quiting the Asda and going to a local shop will cost you more
Well...
No it won't.
As I'm retired I have the time to look around and price things.
It's always cheaper to shop somewhere other than Asda except for the
special offers...
That's a very carefully-worded statement.
|
Who goes to the corner shop?
--
William Black
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea. |
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William Black
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:22 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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"Robert Henderson" <philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:V6xCrpJUStfIFwy7@anywhere.demon.co.uk...
| Quote: |
In message <6e4en6F5a3k8U1@mid.individual.net>, Gaz <gazter@msn.com
writes
Robert Henderson wrote:
Ever since MacMillan made his fatuous remark "You've never had it so
good" British governments have peddled the lie that people are
generally getting wealthier and wealthier. To this lie was added the
lie of the "trickle down" effect to justify the immoral and reckless
selfishness of Thatcherism.
Keep your bread and dripping, keep your rickets, keep your outside toilet,
keep your tin bath once every two weeks, keep your single glazed, cold
houses with damp and squaller, keep your one only meat dish a week on a
sunday, keep your fifteen hour shifts, eighty hour weeks, with nothing to
show for it but a day trip to blackpool.
A world which was long gone by the fifties.... RH
|
Rickets had.
Single glazing was normal, central heating was in hospitals and big
expensive houses, damp in the walls was almost a given and the vast
majority of houses still had outside loos.
Refrigerators didn't get into most UK homes until the early 'seventies. I
know because I made a lot of money selling them...
--
William Black
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea. |
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Robert Henderson
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:27 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
|
|
In message <kknu74desmps4o7cq2cs2oscd2ic8urfs3@4ax.com>, abelard
<abelard3@abelard.org> writes
| Quote: |
algebra in about 1961 when my Dad had to learn it for his
new job at Boeing. I was the sounding board for tasks such
as drawing maps and simplifying by circles around sets of
ones. I was learning xy + x = x about the same time I was
learing xy + x = x(y+1).
My memories are skewed by youth. Everything seemed fresh
at the time and the possibilities were endless. I remember looking
up at the sky and seeing Sputnik move in the heavens. What
did I know of global politics? The important part was seeing a
man made object in the night sky. (pre-cub scouts)
this is turing in 1950
http://www.abelard.org/turpap/turpap.htm
"It will simplify matters for the reader if I explain first my own
beliefs in the matter. Consider first the more accurate form of the
question. I believe that in about fifty years time it will be possible
to programme computers with a storage capacity of about 10^9 to make
them play the imitation game so well that an average interrogator will
not have more than 70 per cent chance of making the right
identification after five minutes of questioning. The original
question, 'Can machines think?' I believe to be too meaningless to
deserve discussion. Nevertheless I believe that at the end of the
century the use of words and general educated opinion will have altered
so much that one will be able to speak of machines thinking without
expecting to be contradicted.
|
How wrong he was. Even the most advanced (snigger) computers of today
remain mindless servo-mechanisms. As for 1947 vintage valve
computers..... RH
--
Robert Henderson
Blair Scandal website: http://www.geocities.com/ blairscandal/
Personal website: http://www.anywhere.demon.co.uk |
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abelard
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:33 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
|
|
On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 14:59:32 +0100, Robert Henderson
<philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk> wrote:
| Quote: |
In message <n8eu741vqk15k70m10f5lr4sucj011rf1m@4ax.com>, abelard
abelard3@abelard.org> writes
On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 05:34:57 +0100, Robert Henderson
philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk> wrote:
In message <35bs741ri1r1e73uhvgk2hph6mngb4rho6@4ax.com>, abelard
abelard3@abelard.org> writes
much less taisty purchased goods.
Times are just different. Sure, in 1958 I was dreaming of owning a
personal computer
no you weren't
The idea of personal computers was in SF by that time.... RH
even asimov wasn't dreaming of owning a pc....
The complete stories, vol. 1, I.Asimov, 1994, harper collins,
0006476473,
from 'the feeling of power' pp297-308, first published in 1957
'for that matter, compare your pocket computer with the massive jobs
of a thousand years ago' p.304.
Sigh. The point is they were envisaged. RH
|
don't be daft hatstand....
a thousand years to get to a pocket computer/calculator from
1957 by one of the top speculators does not support your
sighs....
as for 'speculations'
greeks dreamt of flight
and babbage hoped to construct a complex logic machine while
jevons made a logical piano....
yes, i know, you're only a strange bag of wet chemicals....
regards....
--
web site at www.abelard.org - news comment service, logic, economics
energy, education, politics, etc 1,552,396 document calls in year past
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
all that is necessary for [] walk quietly and carry
the triumph of evil is that [] a big stick.
good people do nothing [] trust actions not words
only when it's funny -- roger rabbit
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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Thore
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:10 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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|
On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 08:09:47 GMT, "SPierce" <ecreipt@bigpond.net.au>
wrote:
| Quote: |
"Robert Henderson" <philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:V6xCrpJUStfIFwy7@anywhere.demon.co.uk...
In message <6e4en6F5a3k8U1@mid.individual.net>, Gaz <gazter@msn.com
writes
Robert Henderson wrote:
Ever since MacMillan made his fatuous remark "You've never had it so
good" British governments have peddled the lie that people are
generally getting wealthier and wealthier. To this lie was added the
lie of the "trickle down" effect to justify the immoral and reckless
selfishness of Thatcherism.
Keep your bread and dripping, keep your rickets, keep your outside toilet,
keep your tin bath once every two weeks, keep your single glazed, cold
houses with damp and squaller, keep your one only meat dish a week on a
sunday, keep your fifteen hour shifts, eighty hour weeks, with nothing to
show for it but a day trip to blackpool.
A world which was long gone by the fifties.... RH
Not quite. No rickets. But single glazed windows were the norm...as were
the cold and damp. And landladies who would not allow a girl to be in the
bedsit after 10pm.
Never heard of 15 hour shifts except during the war. Never heard of 80
hour weeks either.
|
Not quite Adolf.
We worked 7am to 8pm 5 days a week and 6 to 6 on weekends up to 1972.
We got a total of an hour a day for all breaks and half an hour on
weekend shifts. I did that for 4 years. Mining.
| Quote: |
After the Mini Minor came off the tracks at Longbridge
the incomes of factory workers were high enough for them to go to Spain for
holidays. But yes, it was a slower and more predictable life...but with
sights on a better future... a sense of hope still existed for those who had
fought for the country. Immigration and myscegenation killed it all.
|
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JNugent
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:43 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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|
William Black wrote:
| Quote: |
"JNugent" <JN@NPPTG.com> wrote:
William Black wrote:
and today food is
much cheaper coming from a supermarket than your local butcher or veg
shop so quiting the Asda and going to a local shop will cost you more
Well...
No it won't.
As I'm retired I have the time to look around and price things.
It's always cheaper to shop somewhere other than Asda except for the
special offers...
That's a very carefully-worded statement.
Who goes to the corner shop?
|
That was one of the things being compared (the other being supermarkets
in general). The two things being distinguished in your post were Asda
and the rest of the supermarkets - a completely different comparison. |
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abelard
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:44 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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|
On Thu, 17 Jul 2008 17:27:07 +0100, Robert Henderson
<philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk> wrote:
| Quote: |
In message <kknu74desmps4o7cq2cs2oscd2ic8urfs3@4ax.com>, abelard
abelard3@abelard.org> writes
algebra in about 1961 when my Dad had to learn it for his
new job at Boeing. I was the sounding board for tasks such
as drawing maps and simplifying by circles around sets of
ones. I was learning xy + x = x about the same time I was
learing xy + x = x(y+1).
My memories are skewed by youth. Everything seemed fresh
at the time and the possibilities were endless. I remember looking
up at the sky and seeing Sputnik move in the heavens. What
did I know of global politics? The important part was seeing a
man made object in the night sky. (pre-cub scouts)
this is turing in 1950
http://www.abelard.org/turpap/turpap.htm
"It will simplify matters for the reader if I explain first my own
beliefs in the matter. Consider first the more accurate form of the
question. I believe that in about fifty years time it will be possible
to programme computers with a storage capacity of about 10^9 to make
them play the imitation game so well that an average interrogator will
not have more than 70 per cent chance of making the right
identification after five minutes of questioning. The original
question, 'Can machines think?' I believe to be too meaningless to
deserve discussion. Nevertheless I believe that at the end of the
century the use of words and general educated opinion will have altered
so much that one will be able to speak of machines thinking without
expecting to be contradicted.
How wrong he was. Even the most advanced (snigger) computers of today
remain mindless servo-mechanisms. As for 1947 vintage valve
computers..... RH
|
it's a very complex notion/test.....i've done some analysis here
http://www.abelard.org/turing/tur-hi.htm
regards
--
web site at www.abelard.org - news comment service, logic, economics
energy, education, politics, etc 1,552,396 document calls in year past
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
all that is necessary for [] walk quietly and carry
the triumph of evil is that [] a big stick.
good people do nothing [] trust actions not words
only when it's funny -- roger rabbit
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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Ads |
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Sponsor
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JNugent
Guest
|
| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:46 pm Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
|
|
William Black wrote:
| Quote: |
"Robert Henderson" <philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:V6xCrpJUStfIFwy7@anywhere.demon.co.uk...
In message <6e4en6F5a3k8U1@mid.individual.net>, Gaz <gazter@msn.com
writes
Robert Henderson wrote:
Ever since MacMillan made his fatuous remark "You've never had it so
good" British governments have peddled the lie that people are
generally getting wealthier and wealthier. To this lie was added the
lie of the "trickle down" effect to justify the immoral and reckless
selfishness of Thatcherism.
Keep your bread and dripping, keep your rickets, keep your outside toilet,
keep your tin bath once every two weeks, keep your single glazed, cold
houses with damp and squaller, keep your one only meat dish a week on a
sunday, keep your fifteen hour shifts, eighty hour weeks, with nothing to
show for it but a day trip to blackpool.
A world which was long gone by the fifties.... RH
Rickets had.
Single glazing was normal, central heating was in hospitals and big
expensive houses, damp in the walls was almost a given and the vast
majority of houses still had outside loos.
Refrigerators didn't get into most UK homes until the early 'seventies. I
know because I made a lot of money selling them...
|
All true.
If you were watching the TV ads and reading the Sunday supplements, it
might have been possible to overlook all of it, but that was the reality
for most people. I never lived in a household with use of a car until I
was 21. My first fridge? 26, when I bought my first house.
I never had central heating until I was ... er .... 37. |
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Bert Hyman
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| Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:00 am Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk (Robert Henderson) wrote in
news:wKpLnzq2B1fIFwVI@anywhere.demon.co.uk:
| Quote: |
In message <Xns9ADE556936C2BVeebleFetzer@127.0.0.1>, Bert Hyman
bert@iphouse.com> writes
philip@anywhere.demon.co.uk (Robert Henderson) wrote in
news:eSIAxrdyZgfIFwAr@anywhere.demon.co.uk:
People do not miss that which they do not have. Most importantly
man does not live by bread alone
Do you think they'd miss the bread if they didn't have it?
That is not the point of the adage. RH
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So what? I was asking for a clarification of your own position,
"People do not miss that which they do not have.", which is absurd on
its face.
--
Bert Hyman | St. Paul, MN | bert@iphouse.com |
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William Black
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| Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:09 am Post subject: Re: The "we are all getting wealthier" lie |
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"JNugent" <JN@NPPTG.com> wrote in message
news:GKedneVwzYV1D-LVnZ2dnUVZ8sPinZ2d@pipex.net...
| Quote: |
William Black wrote:
"JNugent" <JN@NPPTG.com> wrote:
William Black wrote:
and today food is
much cheaper coming from a supermarket than your local butcher or veg
shop so quiting the Asda and going to a local shop will cost you more
Well...
No it won't.
As I'm retired I have the time to look around and price things.
It's always cheaper to shop somewhere other than Asda except for the
special offers...
That's a very carefully-worded statement.
Who goes to the corner shop?
That was one of the things being compared (the other being supermarkets in
general). The two things being distinguished in your post were Asda and
the rest of the supermarkets - a completely different comparison.
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My wife and I both dislike supermarkets and both prefer traditional covered
markets.
The food tends to be both cheaper and fresher.
We also shop at Bookers, we have a card because we do the shopping for an
organisation that uses a lot of tea and coffee and biscuits.
Bookers sells stuff in vast quantities, but we have the storage to take
advantage of that.
We buy most of our booze abroad.
There are things that the supermarkets sell cheaply. Soft drinks and bread
are the two that spring to mind.
But you need the time to do all this.
--
William Black
I've seen things you people wouldn't believe.
Barbeques on fire by the chalets past the castle headland
I watched the gift shops glitter in the darkness off the Newborough gate
All these moments will be lost in time, like icecream on the beach
Time for tea. |
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